Domestic carbines for caliber 223 rem. The heirs of the legendary "mosquito"

Tourism and rest 30.07.2019

Tourism and rest

wildhinter 09-02-2018 16:54

Good day,
Please advise a carbine in 223 caliber in 8 twist

mostly interested in upland, I thought for a long time what caliber to stop at, I decided 223, but if someone corrects me, I will be grateful

requirements ... want the most precision weapons no more wishes

Thank you in advance.

Alexander L M 09-02-2018 17:42

At the forest, I would look like this gun Heim 22f cal 20-70, 222 or like this Sabatti Forest, cal. 20/76-22 Hornet.

annrnd 09-02-2018 18:20

The best classic bolt in 223 is Sako 85, just below that is Tikka T3. On all sites and in all topics they know this and say only good things. High-precision people also respect them. All other rifles are good too, but Sako is the best!

wildhinter 10-02-2018 11:15

quote: Originally posted by annrnd:

The best classic bolt in 223 - Sako 85

Thanks, but in what way?
the site has a large selection of modifications in this caliber, both varmint and hunter ...

wildhinter 10-02-2018 11:23

and even in hunter there are two options
differences in barrel length - 570 and 510
in 570 length open sight, and in 510 Muzzle thread... xs what is it, something is connected with the muzzle, but I don't know what....

annrnd 10-02-2018 13:40

brown does good rifles, but X is the level of Tiki, nor Saki! X has a worse store, no sights, Sako 85 is all iron, better and more beautiful, in the USA the price is about $ 2000 tons. Amer never overprices. Pick up Saku 85 and you will see the perfect quality of everything, even inside under the tree. It’s a pity, but they are not in stores and will not be until this government ...

wildhinter 10-02-2018 13:52

Thanks again, so I need to go to the store
I just look nowhere in stock, probably only on order

kodec 10-02-2018 14:31

quote: Muzzle thread... xs what is it, something with a muzzle

nut at the end
https://www.google.ru/search?q...=org.mozilla:en

wildhinter 10-02-2018 15:10

already figured out) thread, not a nut.

looks like you can put something in there...

ak2a 10-02-2018 15:36

quote: Brown makes good rifles, but Tier X Tiki, no Saki! X has a worse store, no sights, Sako 85 is all iron, better and more beautiful, in the USA the price is about $ 2000 and it's worth a lot. Amer never overprices. When you pick up Saku 85 you will see the perfect quality of everything, even inside under the tree. It is a pity, but they are not in stores and will not be until this power:

Who scattered them across the levels?)) What is worse than the store? plastic here and there .. The presence of sights depends on the model in all of the above .. The X-bolt is also all iron, Tikki has a plastic shutter sleeve, Sako - I don’t remember .. Better and more beautiful - it’s like someone, a subjective opinion) I kept it like then in the hands of Sako - a good thing, but not a delight ..

wildhinter 10-02-2018 15:54

for me personally, the main thing is maximum accuracy, reliability, unpretentiousness, low weight

Solo.lv 10-02-2018 16:45

Tikki's shutter sleeve is plastic, Sako - I don't remember ..

Tikki has no plastic on the shutter, for several years now. Yes, and on the old ones, change it in a few seconds. Remained plastic magazine and triggerguard. Sako is a really high-quality rifle, but if for hunting, then Tikki is enough for the eyes.

wildhinter 10-02-2018 17:23

and in the price between Takka and Sako what will be the difference?

Solo.lv 10-02-2018 17:44

and in the price between Takka and Sako what will be the difference?

I can’t speak for Russia, but we have an average of one and a half times.

wildhinter 10-02-2018 17:53

a serious difference ... on the Internet, I have not yet found a price for either one or the other, everything is custom-made for something.

gsw hunter 10-02-2018 18:19

quote: Originally written by wildhinter:
a serious difference ... on the Internet, I have not yet found a price for either one or the other, everything is custom-made for something.

Have you heard of sanctions?

wildhinter 10-02-2018 19:09

from some specific countries, weapons fell under sanctions for entry into the Russian Federation?

-SNV- 10-02-2018 19:13

quote: Please advise a carbine in 223 caliber in 8 twist

Perhaps only tikka or ChZ527, but there is already the 9th one from the budget, and basically everyone goes with the 12th twist (((

jasav 10-02-2018 19:19

Take chz 527. You don't need more for hunting.

Does the tikki seriously have a plastic trigger? Is it for everyone or 223 only?

wildhinter 10-02-2018 19:32

What are the downsides of the combo option? found Zoli RT Corona St 12/.223, but it's not clear what the twist is, the manufacturer's website is not at all informative.

and so, in my opinion, the combo is also interesting, and 12 gauge is at hand and rifled

gsw hunter 10-02-2018 19:37

quote: Originally written by wildhinter:
from some specific countries, weapons fell under sanctions for entry into the Russian Federation?

USA, Germany, Finland...
Incl. from import CZ or Italians ... Either Orsis.
You can also buy Lobaevskaya😸

gsw hunter 10-02-2018 19:39

gsw hunter 10-02-2018 19:43

quote: Originally written by wildhinter:
Good day,
.. I want the most high-precision weapon, no more wishes
.......
PS I also thought about the combined version, but did not understand if I needed it ...

If you want high-precision, then you definitely don’t need ....

stefan2 10-02-2018 20:04

If only hog, I'm for the melkan. Quiet, the feathers are in place, the cartridge is cheap. My friend managed to take ducks under 200 meters.

annrnd 10-02-2018 20:20

What is the purchase budget? ……. Sako 85 has a metal magazine and the price in the USA for it is one and a half to two times higher than Brown X. Everyone shoots the same way. Zhiguli and Porsche are also cars.

wildhinter 10-02-2018 20:54

And why are you choosing a name with an 8 twist?

wildhinter 10-02-2018 21:03

and I have a pneuma with a resolution of 6.35, up to 100m it completely closes all the questions, moreover, without sound at all. I'm interested in distances greater than 100m

gsw hunter 10-02-2018 22:03

quote: Originally written by wildhinter:
I read it on the forum, as I understand it, the speed is less, the bird breaks less ... many wrote about it in topics about hunting with a rifled bird
the budget is up to 150tr, but the less the better, of course, maybe IL will be enough for me, but as I understand it, it needs to be adjusted, customized, and so on, but I'm not special in this ...

ak2a 10-02-2018 22:18

quote: Tikki has no plastic on the shutter, for several years now.

yeah. probably as many years as she has not been delivered here)))

wildhinter 10-02-2018 22:56

quote: Originally posted by gsw-hunter:

The speed to a greater extent depends not on the twist, but on the length of the barrel and the cartridge ...

in the end, I decided to buy 223, taking a shorter barrel, and then dig into the cartridges,
I think you can ask people who understand for money and they will individually do something for you

something like this

maybe everything will work out of the box, I don't know

wildhinter 10-02-2018 23:03

rummaged through the twists and found this)) just like my reasoning)
taken from here

I would not "build" anything, especially in the literal, physical sense,
adjusting himself to some cartridge from some manufacturer.
Thank God, there is reloading and that's where it happens
fine adaptation / adjustment of ammunition for a specific weapon and task.
And schematically, the plan for such a "construction" for the task may look like this ...

1. Under the task is selected:
1.1. In general, the caliber
1.2. In general, the weapon model in this caliber, if it is a factory rifle,
or
1.3. Components are selected: barrel, bolt group,
stock and trigger if you are really building a rifle.
1.4. A specific bullet is selected, i.e. type and weight
most appropriate to the rifling pitch of your barrel at,
shall we say, the most typical initial speeds.
In other words, a bullet with such a weight is selected,
so that the stabilization coefficient at a given initial
speed and this twist was more than 1.3 - 1.5.

2. Under the weapon (barrel length, its twist, chamber characteristics),
with the help of reloading, the charge and the depth of the bullet landing are adjusted.

ak2a 10-02-2018 23:25

hmm .. and this is all for the sake of prey of a black grouse or a hare?
Fundamental approach.
There is another option: take the screw you like a 223m. Twist don't even ask. Choose from 2-3 options a more accurate cartridge! Attention! on the hunt!
The advantage of this option is the time saved. Money. Vision after all (I'm talking about the computer screen). That's all if we are talking about hunting for upland.
You need dances with tambourines - bother with twists, speeds, stops on the shutters, grades of gunpowder, bullet seating depth, rotation coefficients, or whatever and so on. Moreover, in the end the result will be the same - black grouse, capercaillie, something else extracted sometimes with a hole. Sometimes shattered. Sometimes to smithereens.
On the other hand, a long journey can take you in the other direction, and then the hunt will fade into the background and you will get the buzz from the very process of preparations ..

wildhinter 10-02-2018 23:54

Yes, I have almost decided, I just need to look at prices and availability

ak2a 10-02-2018 23:57

What kind of presence is there ... only ChZets and Mannlichers .. The rest is used ..

kamyak 11-02-2018 12:41

Twist in fact only affects the weight of the bullet that can be heaped. From 12 twists to 233 you won't fire a 69 grain (4 gram) bullet, but from the 9th it's quite easy.
With 8 twists, as far as I remember, only Finns were among the hunting weapons, who are now under sanctions.
Take calmly CZ527 with 9th twist and shoot. Just check the twist when buying, the old ones all came mostly with the 12th, since that year everything seems to be already with the 9th. Although this is not essential for hunting weapons. Your main bullets will still be 50-55 grains.
In Okhotaktiv there is also a Remington XCR 223 from old deliveries, it has a 9th twist, but there is a crowbar barrel with fullers, it is heavy for running hunting. An exceptionally accurate stainless steel barrel, I am not overjoyed at shooting.

wildhinter 11-02-2018 12:54

quote: Originally posted by kamyak:

Twist in fact only affects the weight of a bullet that can be heaped

that is, with a smaller twist, you can work with heavier bullets?

just for some reason, manufacturers make different barrel lengths, twists,
here is tikka hunter

Barrel length (mm) 570 510
223 Rem / 8” / 6
223 Rem / 12” / 6

8 and 12 is a twist, and the first is the length of the barrel
and what to buy xs, but I'm sure that the difference should be significant, otherwise they would just unify and darn one option in production

sv-2 11-02-2018 06:29

Take Sabatti Rover-870, Hova or CZ-527 and you will never remember, neither about woodpecker, nor about horses! Believe me, they are not worth it!

PulsarN 11-02-2018 10:35

quote: Originally written by wildhinter:
I am mainly interested in upland, I thought for a long time what caliber to stop at, I decided 223, but if someone corrects me, I will be grateful

take a closer look, as already mentioned, at CZ 527, but not in .223, but in 7.62x39.
A very gentle cartridge. If desired, with the appropriate bullet, you can take larger representatives of our fauna. A very light, short and reversible rifle chambered for a cheap common cartridge. Bought one for myself. Very satisfied. As one of my acquaintances the huntsman said about vintar: "The dream of a poacher" He meant its versatility.

gsw hunter 11-02-2018 11:37

quote: Take Sabatti Rover-870

If memory serves, he is not in 223...

ak2a 11-02-2018 11:47

quote: but not in .223, but in 7.62x39.

then 243 is better! the cartridge is more expensive, but you can shoot up to 250 meters with virtually no amendments ..

PulsarN 11-02-2018 12:12

quote: Originally written by ak2a:

then 243 is better! the cartridge is more expensive, but you can shoot up to 250 meters with virtually no amendments ..

eternal dream: to shoot without corrections for millions of kilometers, what is the problem, knowing the ballistics of a particular ammunition, and the capabilities of a particular sight, shoot 7,62x39? How often will the vehicle shoot at the forest at 250 m? What will happen to the boron from the 243rd? The questions are rhetorical.
ChZ527 under 7.62x39 has a number of already mentioned advantages (in addition to the characteristics of the cartridge itself): short (total length 92.2 cm), very light (2.65 kg), reversible, fairly accurate. For walkers in the forest, "what the doctor wrote down." What .243 on the upland? Let's suggest 7 mm rem mag then. Well, a flat cartridge or .300 WSM. 8x68S is also possible to shoot far without corrections. Yopnul, so yopnul - let all living things die

Achinsk 11-02-2018 13:28

quote: Originally written by wildhinter:
I will not argue with physics, of course, here I agree with you
in fact, no one knows for sure, just try to google on the Hansa, some reasoning. but after reading a bunch of topics here, I settled on this caliber, and it seems to be the statement that a lower speed breaks the bird less, or rather that at a lower speed the bullet pierces
in the end, I decided to buy 223, taking a shorter barrel, and then dig into the cartridges ...

If you want, here you are personal experience(a couple of hundred boron), a combination of "Saezhka" with 415 mm. barrel, 9th twist, and FMJ from BPZ 4 gr., hardly anyone can accuse of excessive speed (especially in winter), it’s still a lottery, maybe 60 m. “like an awl”, or maybe 180 m. down", but still tears more often, not necessarily "down", but tearing off a wing or leg there at the exit is easy.

wildhinter 11-02-2018 13:53

thank you very much for your advice,
Now I'm going to read and understand everything.

sv-2 11-02-2018 16:14

Fully agree with
Pulsar N.
Sabatti Rovera-600 7.62-x39. Here is the perfect weapon for a boron.

ak2a 11-02-2018 16:47

wildhinter 11-02-2018 16:55

quote: Originally posted by ak2a:

here I am talking about too

sv-2 11-02-2018 18:54

quote: But will it fit at least in the size of the same black grouse for the same 200m?

And in which forest is 200m to a black grouse?
In the field of another vopresh!

ak2a 11-02-2018 19:09

"Borovaya" - this does not mean in the forest)) Black grouse often sit on the edges, on a birch or alder.

PulsarN 11-02-2018 20:19

quote: Originally written by ak2a:
Barnaul, of course, is a reputable manufacturer ... But will it fit at least the size of the same black grouse for the same 200m?

see the profile topic - there are targets

here, for example, windrowing Barnaul at 100 m

for some reason, many rest only on flatness. but if you know the ballistics of the cartridge, you can "shoot" at it. But what about side winds?
at two hundred meters, an 8-gram bullet of 7.62x39 with a side wind of only 3 m / s will be demolished by 14.2 cm. And what, under similar conditions, with, for example, a 3.5 gram bullet. Do many take this into account? Many wind in the open are able to read in the target area? in the morning I got ready to hunt, looked at the weather forecast, but on the spot it did not materialize - the direction or speed of the wind changed and the manda was hunting

I have a friend who shoots perfectly "hole in hole" at the shooting range in Biserovo from the table. He turns the cartridges himself, he is all such a sniper. And I went for some kind of goat (or a ram, I don’t remember already) to the mountains and fucked up the money. in theory, he knew about the winds and about the angles, etc. But that was a real hunt, there were no Biserovo galleries and a favorite table with a machine

I mean that the flatness of a particular cartridge is plus or minus a constant value, and the wind in real conditions in an open area can change. therefore, other things being equal, a more wind-resistant bullet will be more interesting for hunting (for shooting from a table in a closed or semi-closed gallery - it doesn’t care about the wind there). and the 39th cartridge is also more versatile, moreover, as I wrote earlier. what you need for hunting. from p / o roe deer fall only on the way. not to mention foxes, beavers, etc. and the shell does not tear the bird.

miro 11-02-2018 20:54

I advise - savage 10 f in 223)) a friend sells - 35 thousand shots - 50 pieces, they bought two of the same, only I'm in 308 - descent accu trigger? gorgeous

gsw hunter 11-02-2018 21:50

quote: at two hundred meters, an 8-gram bullet 7,62x39 with a side wind of only 3 m / s will be demolished by 14,2 cm. And what, under similar conditions, with, for example, a 3,5 gram bullet.

I have 4.5g with 9 twists on 200m with 3m/s wind for 3hrs = 7.3cm

wildhinter 12-02-2018 19:35

quote: Originally posted by gsw-hunter:

quote: Originally posted by Pulsar N:

at two hundred meters, an 8-gram bullet of 7.62x39 with a side wind of only 3 m / s will be demolished by 14.2 cm.

something doesn't add up...

gsw hunter 12-02-2018 20:41

quote: Originally written by wildhinter:
something doesn't add up...

Why should they get together?

PulsarN 12-02-2018 20:48

something doesn't add up...

we are talking about different cartridges: 7.62x39 and .223

PulsarN 12-02-2018 20:49

quote: Originally written by gsw-hunter:

I have 4.5g with 9 twists on 200m with 3m/s wind for 3hrs = 7.3cm

gsw hunter 12-02-2018 21:04

I'm not familiar with the 223rd. perhaps it high speed somehow compensates for the drift of a light bullet (light compared to the 39th cartridge)

NRVT
Vo=850m/s
BC=0.371

wildhinter 12-02-2018 21:11

quote: Originally posted by gsw-hunter:

Why should they get together?

sorry, I put it wrong, just respected Pulsar N, unfortunately, I don’t know your name, I wrote that 8g is less demolished, but in the end it turned out the other way around, with your data.

although, of course, this is all very inaccurate, maybe there was a gust of wind in one case, at the end of the bullet’s movement, and on the other hand, on the contrary, there was a lull ... as a version.

PulsarN 12-02-2018 21:23

quote: Originally posted by wildhinter:

I also think that a heavy bullet should be less prone to drift

I thought so too

gsw hunter 12-02-2018 22:12

quote: Originally posted by Pulsar N:
I thought so too

If their design / shape and speed were the same, then YES.

Achinsk 14-02-2018 23:57

quote: Originally written by ak2a:
Barnaul, of course, is a reputable manufacturer ... But will it fit at least the size of the same black grouse for the same 200m?

A difficult question, this is hunting, not a table at the shooting range, there are still a lot of nuances, weapons, position, sight, shooter skills, etc. and Zeiss, will not give a 100% result.

ak2a 15-02-2018 09:39

That's the point. an imported hunting rifle at 223m, striking per minute with a factory cartridge, is a common thing. The same in 7.62x39 - dancing with a tambourine.

sv-2 16-02-2018 14:34

quote: That's the point. imported hunting rifle at 223m, striking per minute with a factory cartridge - a common thing

Just a minute is cheaper for small calibers.

Solo.lv 16-02-2018 15:55

quote: Originally written by sv-2:

Just a minute is cheaper for small calibers.

wildhinter 16-02-2018 17:50

quote: Originally posted by Solo.lv:

And where is the relationship between accuracy and price? The price of a cartridge can affect the skills of the shooter, but not the accuracy of the iron.

bloodsucker 16-02-2018 18:29

CZ527FS
2.5 kg weight

miro 18-02-2018 20:07

CZ527FS2.5kg weight

in hunting contour, plastic and without a sight, they still weigh almost everything

bloodsucker 18-02-2018 21:05

So weigh it and attach a photo, as I remember, almost 2,4 ... short, unfolding accurate ...

bloodsucker 18-02-2018 21:05

Schneller is

miro 18-02-2018 21:58

quote: Originally posted by Bloodsucker:

so weigh it and attach a photo, as I remember, almost 2,4 ... short, sweeping accurate ..

but you must? in the first place, it’s in a tree and with a sight somewhere around 3,2, as far as I remember, it’s a schneller, there’s an accu trigger - a very interesting mechanism, I probably won’t be able to explain, it’s better to read on the Internet, but the point is that the trigger is like from two parts - you squeeze the first one (it is very soft and at the same time works like a fuse), you rest against the second, and then the so-called glass rod - the slightest press and a shot

miro 18-02-2018 22:00

sorry, I thought you asked a question about savage) I never dealt with chesets

Makhanov Vladimir 03-12-2018 14:24

As an AP topic and satisfaction of personal interest, the question is hanging in the window!!!NEW!!! Sako 85 .223 at a price of 120₽. If you have the funds and need the specified caliber, should you take it or not? As the owner of Tikki, I consider the quality of the Finns to be uncompromising, but ORSIS is an annoyance to the brain)))

------------------
With Uv. KM!

miro 04-12-2018 12:19

take of course, orsis, with all due respect, is more expensive (with the exception of the hunting version 120?) and the Finns have a guaranteed result and quality IMHO

Alogyc 04-12-2018 16:07

quote: Originally written by wildhinter:
I also think that a heavy bullet should be less prone to drift

Look at the wrong parameters a little: both heavy and light bullets STABILIZE in flight. Wind drift is not something that simply blows a bullet to the side in flight. And based on this, many people think that it is harder to "blow aside" a heavy bullet. This is not a correct representation of wind drift. I will not delve into science, I will simply pay attention not to weight, but to the time of flight of a bullet. This will be more correct from the point of view of wind drift assessment: the longer the bullet flies to the target, the longer the wind acts on it and the greater the wind drift. Accordingly, the greater the speed of the bullet, the less it will be "blown away" compared to a slower one at the same distance. Those. a light bullet .223 at a speed of 900 m / s will “take away” less than a heavy 7,62 at a speed of 660 m / s, because 223 will reach the target faster, because. the time of "impact of the wind" by 223 will be less.

When shooting "at a distance", heavier bullets carry less, not only because of the greater mass - the main thing is that the bullet has a higher ballistic coefficient. A bullet with BC = 0.5 loses speed slower than a bullet with BC = 0.3, which means that if two such bullets are launched with the same initial speed, then a bullet with BC = 0.5 will reach the target faster (because it will lose speed more slowly) and it means that it will be blown away by the wind less.

Vladimir 150RUS 04-12-2018 18:35

Not there all something thoughts went, too deep.
There is a hunt, there is a tool.
The reload of the 39th cartridge will greatly untie your hands, but the 39th is capable of a wild boar, which cannot be said about the 223rd.
According to twists, everyone understands that it is speed that tears, so they say that the 8th twist is needed for the bird, the meaning of such advice is to launch a much heavier bullet, a heavier bullet in the physics of processes will go at a lower speed than a light one, such as the effect of reducing speed. In fact, the scheme does not work, sometimes a 55gr bullet sews, and 80gr explodes, it happens the other way around, and there are many more options. It is indisputable that the 80g bullet is less subject to wind drift than the 55m, and bird shooting is most often open long distances with a twisting unpredictable wind. And to be honest, it all depends on the place of impact, including if the 39th bullet hits the bone, then the wings will fall far from the head.
I, being the owner of a ChZ-527 with a 12th twist, would still buy today with an 8th or 9th twist, not because I really need it, but because there is simply the opportunity to run something else, a purely unjustified Wishlist.
The upper ceiling of the 223rd is a roe deer, the 39th is already a wild boar, the 308th is quite good, and by the way it vomits smaller, and more precisely, but harder, more expensive and more dangerous at the end.
If there are other carbines under the 308th or larger, then definitely the 223rd boltgun, if other carbines are not planned, then I would take the 39th, the reload will soon be resolved, the trajectory, as they have already correctly said, is a constant and palpable matter.

In the early 1990s, .223 rem weapons were a real exotic in Russia and the CIS countries. However, after a while, many manufacturers began to produce hunting weapon of this caliber. Initially, all these weapons were intended for export to the United States and European countries. Soon, domestic hunters appreciated the advantage of .223 rem cartridges and began to massively buy weapons designed for these cartridges. One of the most famous weapons of this caliber is Vepr-223.

General description of Vepr-223 carbines

The production of hunting carbines Vepr-223 (SOK-97) is carried out by the Vyatka-Polyansky Molot plant. The first carbine was released in 1998. This weapon quickly gained popularity among hunters in Russia and the CIS, who had previously preferred domestic small caliber rifles. Cartridge .223 rem, despite the small caliber, belongs to a completely different class of ammunition. The distance at which these ammunition are effective can be 2-3 times greater than conventional 5.6 mm cartridges.

Currently, the Vyatka-Polyansky Molot plant produces the following modifications of the Vepr carbine:

Standard hunting carbine Vepr-223, which is the base model of the entire line. Its production began in 1998;
Vepr Pioneer-223 - this modification appeared a year after the release of the base model;
Vepr Super-223 - a model that began to be produced in 2000, is distinguished by a different shape of the stock and an orthopedic butt. In addition, the build quality differs from the classic for the better;
Vepr-1V-223 - this model is very reminiscent of the classic RPK.

Among these models, any hunter will choose for himself a modification that is right for him. All carbines have fairly stable accuracy at a distance of 100 meters. Although you should not expect high accuracy rates at long distances from Vepr in any caliber. The Kalashnikov light machine gun is not a sniper rifle, and its development was carried out for completely different purposes.

The design of the Vepr-223 is based on the RPK. All nodes, mechanisms and the principle of operation of carbines are almost identical to the RPK. This is due to the fact that the Molot plant for a long time engaged in the production of Kalashnikov light machine guns. It was logical to establish the production of hunting weapons on the basis of this particular military weapon.

Description of the carbine Vepr-223

The hunting carbine is the base model in .223 rem caliber, launched in 1998. The appearance of this model is no different from the Vepr-308 carbines that were released earlier. This modification is considered the simplest and most versatile in the series. Its main advantage is its low price.

The design features of the Vepr-223 are as follows:

The handguard is made of wood;
Sights machine gun type;
Ability to install an optical sight;
Case and strap included.

Although high-quality foreign-made .223 rem cartridges are quite expensive, you can pick up good domestic ammunition of the same caliber. Ammunition, as a rule, is chosen empirically, by shooting several boxes of cartridges from different manufacturers. The hunting carbine, built on the basis of the RPK, is not distinguished by legibility, so the main criterion for choosing should be accuracy.

Shops for the Vepr-223 come in 5 and 10 rounds. There is also an interesting option for 10 rounds, which outwardly completely resembles the standard one. Although it is illegal in Russia to hunt with magazines that hold more than 10 rounds, it is possible to have them available. Alternatively, you can buy an export one, which is designed for 30 or 45 rounds, only when hunting it should be loaded with no more than 10 rounds. Or you can try to remake the magazine from the AK-74.

Vepr-223 can be used for the following types of shooting:

Hunting for small and medium animals. Just do not shoot at long distances, this is not a sniper rifle, and not even a bolt carbine;
Recreational target shooting. AT last years in the field of shooting ranges and ranges, there has been a steady development trend;
Training in shooting from this type of weapon. Since this caliber has low recoil, it is the best choice for a beginner shooter.

When shooting from a carbine, it is imperative to observe safety precautions.

Specifications Vepr-223 are as follows:

For shooting, ammunition of caliber .223 rem is used;
Shops (regular) for 5 or 10 rounds;
Shooting efficiency is guaranteed by the manufacturer at a distance of up to 300 meters. This does not mean that you should shoot at such distances. After 100 meters, accuracy drops significantly, so the recommended distance for effective shooting, as a rule, does not exceed 150 meters;
The weight of the weapon is 4.2 kg, which is too much for small-caliber weapons, so not every hunter can use this weapon for running hunts;
The length of the barrel varies depending on the modifications. It can be from 42 to 590 mm.

Due to differences in dimensions, you can choose a weapon that is most suitable for specific tasks. For example, for property protection it is better to use shortened options, while for hunting it is better to choose a model with the longest barrel.

Description Vepr-223 Pioneer

Vepr-223 Pioneer is a more expensive modification of the carbine in caliber .223 rem. It has been produced since 1999. This model is significantly lighter in weight than the base Vepr model. The weight of 3.6 kg makes this rifle recommended for women and teenagers.

The main differences of this model are as follows:

The stock is made of high quality walnut;
Butt type "Monte Carlo";
The receiver is much lighter;
The trigger mechanism is made on a separate basis.

In general, this model is quite well assembled and is recommended for shooting at short distances. Due to the build quality, the Pioneer is successfully sold in the US and some European countries.

Vepr-223 Super and its description

The Vepr-223 Super hunting carbine went on sale in 2000. The manufacturer listened to the feedback from the hunters and released a model that was devoid of some of the shortcomings of the basic modification. True, they had to pay a much higher price for this, and it was not possible to remove all the design flaws.

The Super model has a one-piece stock and an orthopedic stock. This modification of the Vepr is more suitable for hunting than its predecessor. A big plus of the design is the ability to conduct fast and accurate shooting. The technical characteristics of this model are almost identical to the performance characteristics of the Vepr-223 Pioneer model, but the build quality is much better.

The most charismatic modification Vepr-233

One of the most interesting and brutal models of the Vepr-223 line is the modification Vepr-1B rem. This is a very specific hunting weapon, which becomes apparent with a cursory glance at it. The fact is that outwardly the Vepr-233-1V model almost completely copies the Kalashnikov light machine gun. Its design is distinguished by the following features:

There is a folding butt;
Bipod for shooting;
Rear sight identical to the rear sight of the RPK;
Slotted flame arrester.

This modification is the heaviest in the line - its weight is 5.2 kg. The main difference from the PKK is the lack of the ability to fire bursts.

Naturally, hunting with the Vepr-233 1B is very problematic. Since shooting ranges are found only in large cities, this model is not widely used in Russia. Basically, the Vepr is acquired by foreigners, who value it very much for appearance and fighting qualities.

Advantages and disadvantages of Vepr-223 carbines

Like any hunting weapon, the Vepr-223 carbine has a number of advantages and disadvantages. As for its merits:

Design light machine gun Kalashnikov is incredibly reliable and hardy;
Despite the fact that automatic carbines are often picky in terms of their choice of ammunition, the good old "Kalash" can "digest" absolutely any ammunition of the right caliber;
The great external resemblance to military weapons also help the Vepr-223 carbine to remain at the peak of popularity.

The problem is that not everyone understands that you cannot make an excellent hunting carbine out of a military PKK, no matter how much you want it. The disadvantages of Vepr-223 are as follows:

Often the base of the front sight is pressed onto the barrel with a warp. And it is noticeable even at first glance. It becomes unclear whether the Molot plant has a quality control department, or whether the assemblers themselves put an acceptance seal on their products;
The rib is also often offset;
The handguard is not only not fitted properly, it is often also asymmetrical on both sides;
The butt is often poorly fixed and has a significant backlash, which greatly affects the accuracy of fire;
Sometimes trigger sticks after the shot and does not fully return to its original position. This leads to the impossibility of setting the carbine on the safety.

If you want to get a better-made product, then it is not recommended to buy base model. It is better to purchase Vepr-223 Super. It is worth noting that as a result of the global refinement, the Vepr-223 in the basic configuration becomes much better than the factory model with the Super prefix.

Troubleshooting Vepr-223 do-it-yourself

In order to eliminate the consequences of inaccurate assembly, you will need a simple set of tools, in which various files and sandpaper of different grain sizes will play the main roles.

To fix problems with a wobbly stock, you just need to try to simply tighten the mounting screws tighter. If that doesn't help, some hunters glue the stock with epoxy.

The rear sight lateral correction mechanism is very annoying in the forest, as the aiming bar often clings to bushes and trees, as a result of which the sight goes astray. After that, you have to shoot the carbine again. Some hunters decide this problem by gluing the screw flywheel to the aiming bar.

Sometimes hunters complain about the shape of the butt and the layer of varnish that is on the forend and butt. The weapon often slips in the hands, so you have to remove the varnish by impregnating the wood with special compounds. Many put a notch on the forearm and stock. The appearance of a notch increases the reliability when handling a weapon, since it is securely fixed, even in winter there are no problems because of this.

To remove the problems associated with malfunctions of the firing mechanism, it will have to be disassembled and carefully examined. As a rule, problems are easily eliminated by grinding elements that are in contact with each other.

You can be sure of one thing for sure - the Vepr-223 automation is incredibly reliable, so if you do not throw the carbine into the mud, it will not fail.

The Vepr-223 is an excellent and fast-firing carbine in its class. For hunting small and medium-sized animals at short distances, it will do just fine. As for security, according to its characteristics, it is ideal as a civilian weapon.

Here you can ask your question to Evgeny Gennadyevich Kopeiko

If you need to attach a photo, please use the file exchange service available to you and indicate the link in the text. If for some reason it is difficult, you can send a photo to.

Lunev Sergey:

Good afternoon, Evgeny Gennadievich. Tell me please. I am faced with the choice of a rifle. Tasks: paper shooting up to 300 m and some fox hunting. The choice was narrowed down to two models. 1.CHZ527 Varmint Kevlar, 2. Tikka T3 Varmint, both calibers.223Rem. ChZ has pluses - a bed with an aluminum bedin block - a schneller, twist 9, or maybe 12, in the minuses, there is no definite answer, and in the store sellers look negatively at attempts at any measurements. Tikki has in the pros - turning the shutter by 75 degrees - definitely 8 twist, in the minuses - soft plastic - a short stock - they write that some kind of spring needs to be changed in the trigger. It’s not that I don’t want to deal with alterations, I just don’t appreciate my qualifications highly enough. I would like to just shoot out of the box. What model do you recommend? Thank you. Sincerely. Sergey.

Carbine caliber .223Rem for shooting at distances up to 300 m

E.G. Kopeiko

From a carbine of caliber .223Rem at a distance of up to 300 m, "... just shoot" out of the box "..." will not work.
You need to prepare well and, in addition to the carbine, acquire a lot, in particular:
- an optical sight with a large lens, for example, a diameter of 56 mm, and a large range of magnification, for example 3-9 or 3-12, etc.,
-rangefinder,
- bipod with telescopic, preferably with three rods, to shoot while standing, sitting, and lying down.
Ammo will be needed in sufficient quantities to check the combat performance and sighting devices at all distances, and then zero the carbine.
But first you have to study the ballistic parameters of .223Rem caliber cartridges from different manufacturers in order to at least partially imagine the possible behavior of small .223Rem caliber bullets weighing 3.2–3.6 g at distances such as 100, 150 and 200 m, not to mention distances of 250 and 300 m. It must be remembered that firms give ballistic parameters obtained by shooting cartridges from a heavy long ballistic barrel.
Of course, the bullet will fly much further, but after all, aimed shooting with at least a satisfactory dispersion is implied.
Obviously, you will have to shoot from bipods at long distances, because. for small bullets of caliber .223Rem weighing 3.2–3.6 g, the distance of both 250 and 300 m is a lot.
For example, in a Sako .223Rem cartridge, the 3.2g Speedhead bullet has the following parameters:
- the distance of the so-called "direct" shot is 177 m,
- the speed of the bullet at the muzzle is 985 m / s,
- the speed of a bullet at a distance of 300 m is 522 m / s,
-when aiming at a point at a distance of 150 m, the bullet goes down by almost 210 mm at a distance of 250 m, and at a distance of 300 m by almost 410 mm.
And this is just the data of the ballistic barrel.
Obviously, a .223Rem carbine for shooting at a distance of up to 300 m must be chosen not by the name of the company and model, but by the parameters of the barrel:
-outside diameter,
-length,
-weight.
It is highly desirable that the trigger mechanism be equipped with a trigger, either with an individual hook or combined with the trigger. After all, even slight fluctuations in the muzzle of the barrel at the time of the shot will take the bullet away from the aiming point.
If you don’t like the CZ527 Varmint Kevlar carbine or the Tikka T3 Varmint carbine according to the expected shooting conditions, then you will have to refuse them, but in fact due to a superficial analysis,
and not to attribute to them "... in the minuses ..." exactly the parameters that they are characterized by and which are incorporated in them during manufacture. So, “…soft plastic…” on the Tikka T3 Varmint carabiner is generally an invention, it is just an external Soft Touch treatment of the plastic stock, which causes a pleasant feeling in the hand.
In a serviceable carbine, "... Doing alterations ..." is unacceptable, and it is useless to discuss a faulty carbine.
By the way, the CZ527 Varmint carbine in .223Rem caliber with a wood stock is equipped with a barrel length of 610 mm and even 650 mm. And the Tikka T3 Varmint carbine in caliber .223Rem with a plastic stock is equipped with a 600mm barrel. These are solid models, they weigh 3.6-3.7 kg. This group also includes the Tikka T3 Super Varmint in .223Rem with a Picatinni rail built into the action and an adjustable top comb on a plastic stock. There is also a Sako 85 Varmint carbine with a 600 mm barrel. Such is the carbine CZ527 Varmint Kevlar caliber .223Rem with a barrel length of 610 mm, but this model is not mass produced, the bed on it firms H-S precision.
In the store, they really won’t let you measure the barrel of a new carbine with no one knows what tool and no one knows who, especially a beginner. The store is responsible for the serviceability of the weapon and for the mirror surface of the channel rifled barrel. But the store should give all the information about the carbine, including the length of the rifling pitch, because. the manufacturer attaches complete documentation to each batch.
However, it is not advisable to name any carbine, the list of those indicated can be continued. But what is written is quite enough for a more serious choice of a .223Rem carbine for shooting at long distances for this caliber up to 300 m.

In the early 1990s, .223 rem weapons were a real exotic in Russia and the CIS countries. However, after some time, many manufacturers began to produce hunting weapons of this caliber. Initially, all these weapons were intended for export to the United States and European countries. Soon, domestic hunters appreciated the advantage of .223 rem cartridges and began to massively buy weapons designed for these cartridges. One of the most famous weapons of this caliber is Vepr-223.

General description of Vepr-223 carbines

The production of hunting carbines Vepr-223 (SOK-97) is carried out by the Vyatka-Polyansky Molot plant. The first carbine was released in 1998. This weapon quickly gained popularity among hunters in Russia and the CIS, who had previously preferred domestic small-caliber rifles for hunting. Cartridge .223 rem, despite the small caliber, belongs to a completely different class of ammunition. The distance at which these ammunition are effective can be 2-3 times greater than conventional 5.6 mm cartridges.

Currently, the Vyatka-Polyansky Molot plant produces the following modifications of the Vepr carbine:

Standard hunting carbine Vepr-223, which is the base model of the entire line. Its production began in 1998;
Vepr Pioneer-223 - this modification appeared a year after the release of the base model;
Vepr Super-223 - a model that began to be produced in 2000, is distinguished by a different shape of the stock and an orthopedic butt. In addition, the build quality differs from the classic for the better;
Vepr-1V-223 - this model is very reminiscent of the classic RPK.

Among these models, any hunter will choose for himself a modification that is right for him. All carbines have fairly stable accuracy at a distance of 100 meters. Although you should not expect high accuracy rates at long distances from Vepr in any caliber. The Kalashnikov light machine gun is not a sniper rifle, and its development was carried out for completely different purposes.

The design of the Vepr-223 is based on the RPK. All nodes, mechanisms and the principle of operation of carbines are almost identical to the RPK. This is due to the fact that the Molot plant has been producing Kalashnikov light machine guns for a long time. It was logical to establish the production of hunting weapons on the basis of this particular military weapon.

Description of the carbine Vepr-223

The design features of the Vepr-223 are as follows:

The handguard is made of wood;
Sights machine gun type;
Ability to install an optical sight;
Case and strap included.

Vepr-223 can be used for the following types of shooting:

Hunting for small and medium animals. Just do not shoot at long distances, this is not a sniper rifle, and not even a bolt carbine;
Recreational target shooting. In recent years, there has been a steady development trend in the field of shooting ranges and polygons;
Training in shooting from this type of weapon. Since this caliber has low recoil, it is the best choice for a beginner shooter.

When shooting from a carbine, it is imperative to observe safety precautions.

The technical characteristics of the Vepr-223 are as follows:

For shooting, ammunition of caliber .223 rem is used;
Shops (regular) for 5 or 10 rounds;
Shooting efficiency is guaranteed by the manufacturer at a distance of up to 300 meters. This does not mean that you should shoot at such distances. After 100 meters, accuracy drops significantly, so the recommended distance for effective shooting, as a rule, does not exceed 150 meters;
The weight of the weapon is 4.2 kg, which is too much for small-caliber weapons, so not every hunter can use this weapon for running hunts;
The length of the barrel varies depending on the modifications. It can be from 42 to 590 mm.

Due to differences in dimensions, you can choose a weapon that is most suitable for specific tasks. For example, for property protection it is better to use shortened options, while for hunting it is better to choose a model with the longest barrel.

Description Vepr-223 Pioneer

The main differences of this model are as follows:

The stock is made of high quality walnut;
Butt type "Monte Carlo";
The receiver is much lighter;
The trigger mechanism is made on a separate basis.

In general, this model is quite well assembled and is recommended for shooting at short distances. Due to the build quality, the Pioneer is successfully sold in the US and some European countries.

Vepr-223 Super and its description

The most charismatic modification Vepr-233

There is a folding butt;
Bipod for shooting;
Rear sight identical to the rear sight of the RPK;
Slotted flame arrester.

This modification is the heaviest in the line - its weight is 5.2 kg. The main difference from the PKK is the lack of the ability to fire bursts.

Advantages and disadvantages of Vepr-223 carbines

Like any hunting weapon, the Vepr-223 carbine has a number of advantages and disadvantages. As for its merits:

The design of the Kalashnikov light machine gun is incredibly reliable and hardy;
Despite the fact that automatic carbines are often picky in terms of their choice of ammunition, the good old "Kalash" can "digest" absolutely any ammunition of the right caliber;
The great external resemblance to military weapons also help the Vepr-223 carbine to remain at the peak of popularity.

The problem is that not everyone understands that you cannot make an excellent hunting carbine out of a military PKK, no matter how much you want it. The disadvantages of Vepr-223 are as follows:

Often the base of the front sight is pressed onto the barrel with a warp. And it is noticeable even at first glance. It becomes unclear whether the Molot plant has a quality control department, or whether the assemblers themselves put an acceptance seal on their products;
The rib is also often offset;
The handguard is not only not fitted properly, it is often also asymmetrical on both sides;
The butt is often poorly fixed and has a significant backlash, which greatly affects the accuracy of fire;
Sometimes the trigger sticks after firing and does not fully return to its original position. This leads to the impossibility of setting the carbine on the safety.

If you want to get a better-made product, then it is not recommended to buy a basic model. It is better to purchase Vepr-223 Super. It is worth noting that as a result of the global refinement, the Vepr-223 in the basic configuration becomes much better than the factory model with the Super prefix.

Troubleshooting Vepr-223 do-it-yourself

In order to eliminate the consequences of inaccurate assembly, you will need a simple set of tools, in which various files and sandpaper of different grain sizes will play the main roles.

To fix problems with a wobbly stock, you just need to try to simply tighten the mounting screws tighter. If that doesn't help, some hunters glue the stock with epoxy.

The rear sight lateral correction mechanism is very annoying in the forest, as the aiming bar often clings to bushes and trees, as a result of which the sight goes astray. After that, you have to shoot the carbine again. Some hunters solve this problem by gluing the screw flywheel to the rib.

You can be sure of one thing for sure - the Vepr-223 automation is incredibly reliable, so if you do not throw the carbine into the mud, it will not fail.

The history of the creation of this unusual carbine was told to us by the world champion in practical shooting Vsevolod Ilyin, who participated in its development and testing. It all started at the moment when Russia received the right to host the first world championship in practical carbine shooting in 2017. There are five disciplines in this sport: two are shooting from self-loading weapons and three from weapons with manual reloading. If everything was going well with semi-automatic weapons for Russian athletes, then with manual reloading, we only had a Mosin rifle. The class with manual reloading has been in the rules for a long time, but has not gained much popularity. Athletes mainly buy semi-automatic rifles, and bolt-action rifles have always been considered the lot of snipers. Yes, it's illogical sniper rifle to shoot so many shots at short range, which is exactly what is required in practical shooting: a fine expensive barrel quickly becomes unusable.

Roman Anikin and Vsevolod Ilyin with a self-loading "Saiga-107" with balanced automatics (left) and a pump-action carbine KSZ-223.

The heirs of the legendary "mosquito"

Nevertheless, such disciplines were included in the championship, and it was necessary to participate in them. Earlier in this class, athletes fired classic bolt-action rifles that have a century-old history in various armies around the world. To increase the rate of fire and accuracy, their design was continuously improved: the angle of rotation of the shutter was reduced, handles of a more convenient shape were invented. The pinnacle of the evolution of such systems was the German Blaser R93 carbine, where reloading was carried out without a transverse turn of the bolt handle. The next stage of development was models with reloading by moving the movable forearm (pump reloading). Such carbines were produced by several companies. The most famous American Remington model 7615 classic form and Troy PAR, created on the basis of the legendary AR-15.

The Remington 7615 is the development of the Remington 7600 hunting rifle line and is designed for sports shooting, as well as for arming police units. Despite its semi-civilian appearance, the carbine allows the use of standard AR-15 magazines.

For obvious reasons, it was wrong to participate in the home championship with American carbines, having its own powerful weapons industry. And in 2016, the Federation of Practical Shooting of Russia turned to the Kalashnikov concern, which already had experience in creating the excellent Saiga-12 sporting gun. 340, with a request to develop a domestic carbine for practical shooting with manual reloading based on the semi-automatic Saiga MK-223.

The Troy PAR is designed and manufactured by the American company Troy Defense. The carbine was created on the basis of the AR-15 self-loading rifle, in which all the nodes responsible for the gas automatics were removed.

It cannot be said that this was a completely new topic for Kalashnikov. At one time, in order to enter the markets of countries where semi-automatic rifles are prohibited, for example, Great Britain and Australia, experimental work was carried out to create a .410 caliber carbine with manual pump-action reloading and methods of operation of the bolt group were worked out. The main ideas for creating the KSZ-223 are borrowed from those same prototypes. The deadlines for the development of a new model were set extremely short, the designers were limited in their choice of solutions, nevertheless they managed.

KSZ-223 manufactured by the Kalashnikov concern. All gold at the last World Championship in practical shooting in the classes of carbines with manual reloading was taken with this weapon.

Design

The main difference from the self-loading Saiga MK-223 is the absence of a gas engine and, accordingly, a gas outlet in the barrel. Reloading is carried out by a longitudinally sliding forearm, rigidly connected to the bolt frame. The receiver, the design of which is borrowed from the AK-103−3, is mounted on a hinge, a contactor is provided in its rear part. Picatinny rail integrated into the lid receiver and allows you to easily install optical and collimator sights. So that the right-hander, without lifting his elbow, could shoot in the prone position, they added a cocking handle on the left. Facilitating the attachment of the store receiver was worked out on the "Saiga-M3", Spanish. "Practice", and the enlarged magazine latch was taken from the design of the first generation "Saiga-107" with balanced automation (IZH-126). The developers installed a new ergonomic pistol grip.

2017 world champion in practical carbine shooting Alena Karelina at a distance.

Golden result

“The concern turned out to be an excellent carbine,” says Vsevolod Ilyin. “The transition to it did not require any period of adjustment from me.” Other athletes are of the same opinion. It is no coincidence that all the gold medals of the first World Championship in practical shooting in the disciplines for hand-loaded carbines were taken by our athletes, who competed with the KSZ-223.

The date of the next championship has not yet been chosen. But, according to the organizers, the next tournament, in all likelihood, will again be held in Russia.